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Session 158: What’s Next For Issa & Lawrence?

The Therapy for Black Girls Podcast is a weekly conversation with Dr. Joy Harden Bradford, a Licensed Psychologist in Atlanta, Georgia, about all things mental health, personal development, and all the small decisions we can make to become the best possible version of ourselves.

Dr. Donna Oriowo, M.Ed, MSW, CST is back for another Insecure debrief this week! She and I chatted about the conditions that had to exist for Issa & Lawrence to be able to have that conversation, how you might know if you need to or are ready for a conversation like that with someone from your past, our thoughts on whether this was a closure conversation or a brand new start, and our predictions for the rest of the season.


  • Opening check-in on how we are feeling in the World [3:33]
  • A brief discussion examining the ethics of the mental health industry [5:21]
  • How joy is crucial to the revolution and why this episode of Insecure felt so important [7:34]
  • Concept: The closure conversation clients think they’re going to have with an ex vs.the reality [13:02]
  • On getting back together with an ex the detailed process of how and why [15:22]
  • Doing a relationship autopsy and adjusting to the growth [25:44]
  • A discussion about the work that goes into showing up as who you are [26:40]
  • Why was Condola calling? [29:43]
  • Reflecting on how Issa is stepping into her new confidence, asking for what she wants, and reframing the idea of the walk of shame [32:55]
  • Are Lawrence and Issa getting back together? [37:49]
  • Black Love: The familiarity, the comfort, the calm, and the peace of it all [40:17]
  • Predictions for next week’s episode and the season [43:22]

Resources Mentioned

Visit our Amazon Store for all the books mentioned on the podcast!

Where to Find Dr. Oriowo

Grab a copy of the Relationship Goals worksheet

Grab a copy of Cocoa Butter & Hair Grease

Instagram: @annodright

Twitter: @drdonnaoriowo

Listen to Dr. Oriowo here on Session 155 of the podcast discussing Molly & Issa’s friendship.

Listen to Dr. Oriowo here on Session 151 of the podcast discussing the Season 4 premiere of Insecure.

Listen to Dr. Oriowo here on Session 60 of the podcast discussing colorism and texturism.

If you’re looking for a therapist in your area, check out the directory at

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The hashtag for the podcast is #TBGinSession.

Make sure to follow us on social media:

Twitter: @therapy4bgirls

Instagram: @therapyforblackgirls

Facebook: @therapyforblackgirls


Discover the transformative power of healing in community in Dr. Joy Harden Bradford’s debut book, Sisterhood Heals. Order your copy now!

Sisterhood heals
Order Now

Looking for the UK Edition?
Order here

Discover the transformative power of healing in community in Dr. Joy Harden Bradford’s debut book, Sisterhood Heals. Order your copy now!

Looking for the UK Edition? Order here